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12-year-old RIAA victim settles
The RIAA's bullying tactics against a 12-year-old girl and her mother have worked.
Brianna Lahara, who was on the RIAA sue 'em all list for listening to online music, will pay $2000 to the record labels' personal police force so she or her mother won't have to appear in court.
"[...] as this case illustrates, parents need to be aware of what their children are doing on their computers," said Mitch Bainwol said in one of his first public utterances since taking over from Hilary Rosen as RIAA boss.
Brianna aparently believed that by paying Sharman Networks $29.99 for its so-called ad-free Kazaa, she was entitled download wharever songs she wanted.
In the meanwhile, the RIAA says it's agreed to settle with other victims for around $3,000 - but that the price for anyone who wants to settle out of court is going to go up.
User Comments
(These do not necessarily reflect the beliefs of this site)
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djjayo1
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 9:38 AM
Yeah they rushed in to settle this one, due the PR nightmare they would have had.
I am glad though that Brianna got the attention she did, more people will be looking at these matters very closely in light of these developements. |
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taddzilla
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 9:48 AM
Tech TV will be hosting a discussion on the entire issue. It is called Music Wars. See the link below, sign up and send in your questions.
http://www.techtv.com/specials/story/0,24330,3510431,00.html |
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CodeWarrior
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 9:48 AM
"[...] as this case illustrates, parents need to be aware of what their children are doing on their computers," said Mitch Bainwol said in one of his first public utterances since taking over from Hilary Rosen as RIAA boss."
Yes Itchy, and where should good little parents go to report their children where you can sue them? Please provide us with an 800 number so that good new world order parents can rat on their own kids for a reward?
"Mr. Sherman,at long last, sir, have you no sense of decency? Have you no shame?"
~code
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justed
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 9:50 AM
Gee, that ($2,000) won’t even pay for a victory celebration lunch for these f*t @#@^$^*%%$!
Oh well, at least they made a little girl cry.
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tds67
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 9:58 AM
This is very disturbing...I feel like I woke up this morning in another country.
The RIAA is being so cavalier about this. Their attitude is: "Kids or their parents, it don't make no difference to us. Give us the money and let that be a lesson to you."
DEATH TO THE RIAA. |
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djjayo1
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:04 AM
Code, that's true.
Most parents don't even know how to use a pc, but their kids do. So how are the parents to know they are doing anything wrong when the need the kids to turn the dang (notice I didn't swear) thing on for them.
I saw somewhere else, I'll try to find the link, where a parent of another kid sued Aske the child what he would due if a major band play music he wrote and he didn't get paid for it? The kid responded that would be awsome. Note, how kids hold the fame in promotion more important to the monatary reward for their work.
The major acts need to start realizing this, for one gives freely only when they are given free choice to give, giving no choice to give freely will get you nothing. |
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CodeWarrior
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:09 AM
Here's how I feel about "RIAA music"
Cary-Sue:
I'd rather listen to my two cats playing tic-tac-toe with their claws on a blackboard than that crap you are melting onto plastic.
Also, Cary-Sue, aren't you getting behind on your ambulance chasing?
"Mr. Sherman,at long last, sir, have you no sense of decency? Have you no shame?"
~code |
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luthien
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:10 AM
"and where should good little parents go to report their children where you can sue them? Please provide us with an 800 number so that good new world order parents can rat on their own kids for a reward?"
Another comparison to 1984??? Where families spy on each other for Big Brother???
I am just so glad I don't live in America, the 'land of the free'!?! |
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svengali
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:21 AM
12 years old living with her mother in public housing....how long will it take to pay that back? |
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nyer82
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:25 AM
I can't blame this girl for settling, even though I wish someone had provided her lots of money to go ahead into court.
Anyway, I think we all should start some kinda donation thing to help pay the people back, for the RIAAs most egregious violations. Not every suit, just the ones that piss us off the most. Like this girl's. I think she should get her 2 Grand back. |
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PhantomGhost
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:28 AM
They couldn't stand the negative publicity, so they settled for a low price- only two grand. Well, they won't be able to get away with that for long. |
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NCdude
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:35 AM
In the very near future we'll see this girl and her mother suing Kazaa for missleading them. And maybe someone from the RIAA will help them with the lawsuit against Kazaa? |
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John316
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:36 AM
Code: You are right my friend. Thanks for correcting me. I guess I let my feelings get in the way of my judgement. Jesus does say love your enemy and pray for them (Matthew 5:43-48) and this will heap coals upon their head. You know I am not as angry at Sherman as I am at their organization. I can't stand corrupt, deceitful companies who say one thing and turn around and do another. Being a hypocrite is what the RIAA is all about. Going after this lil girl and elderly man will be their ultimate downfall. This is PR SUICIDE. The RIAA will not be around for much longer after this debacle.
I was watching Dan Abrams last nite, and he too sides with tthe RIAA. He says that file sharing is a crime and that those who are caught should have to face the punishment the RIAA wants to dish out. Well I guess I will NEVER watch his show ever again. I am going to Boycott any person or company that sides with the HYPOCRITICAL RIAA.
The only thing evil needs to triumph is for good people to go nothing.
If you stand for nothing you will fall for anything.
Peace Brothers & Sisters |
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CodeWarrior
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:43 AM
Good words my friend and always appreciate. Mr. Abrams, of Court TV, is a lawyer, and I find it quite natural for him to side with another ambulance chaser, Cary-Sue.
Blessings be to you John316
~code |
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John316
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:57 AM
Code: Blessings to you as well brother. Keep up the good work.
Peace |
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chewins
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 10:58 AM
This story makes me sick!! It shows how much power companies really have and how they don’t care about our society. How can they call themselves Americans?! Americans care about society and they obviously don’t!!
They have to be stopped!!!
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kneo24
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:01 AM
Someone tell me how it's possible for people in the projects to even afford shelling out two grand for something like this? |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:03 AM
You are all a bunch of crybabies. Especially Codewarrior. Hey Code what do you do for a living? Do you expect to get paid for your work or do you do it for free? Does your mommy pay your rent and your food bill? |
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UmakeBabyJes...
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:17 AM
Well, I am NEVER buying another cd(Indy all the way). And where was J-Blow from the block(You know, the "hood", the "ghetto")Don't be fooled by the rocks she's got. She still gonna leave your 12 year old to get shot. Out of the millions she's has, not a word on this 12 year old that got busted for downloading her songs. Not that's it's J-blows responsabilty, but the girl is 12, loves your music, can't afford your music, downloads your music, gets a nice $2000 bill(and the living crap scared out of her) for your songs. Least you could do is say something. Bitch. You have the media coverage, not us low life consumers. Me, being a real musician and all, would have been happy someone loves my music and "needs" to have it. If I had the cash(which J-blow does, I would pay that $2000 and give her everyone of my cd's. Not J-blow. So I hope all you worthless "Artists" loose all your money, starve, die and get forgotton, just like the RIAA pigs you serve. Harsh? I think not. Man I'm pissed. If anyone has links to "artists" that have stood up to the RIAA, I would love to see them. I need to know who not to hate. Man I'm pissed. |
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:24 AM
Wow, I'm so glad that the RIAA has taught a lesson to a true "menace to society", a 12-yr-old honor student living in the projects. I'm a college student (not supported by my parents) who lives in the projects myself, and I support myself on $3,000.00 a year. And the RIAA cries about me not purchasing cd's for $16.00 a piece (to listen to the ONE decent song)! Go sit in your mansion and cry! Why don't you use all this time and money to combat drugs/gangs/hunger/serial killers! Instead of shaking down single mom's and 12-yr-olds for what is pocket change to you. |
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grumpygeezer
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:25 AM
Ah, the enemy in our camp -- what a nice surprise.
(How is it we allow them access here?)
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:26 AM
Crybaby said: "Me, being a real musician and all, would have been happy someone loves my music and "needs" to have it"
Yeah sure Crybaby. I guess your're a real musician whose mommy pays your rent. That's why you don't care about making money. I hope you try to make it as a musician when your mommy stops supporting you. Then you'll be whining about how you can't make a living because everyone is stealing your music. Then you'll have to get a job in telemarketing calling people all day trying to sell them stuff while they hang up on you. Good luck, Mr. "Real Musician". |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:28 AM
"Ah, the enemy in our camp -- what a nice surprise. (How is it we allow them access here?)"
Yeah, God forbid you permit freedom of speech and open debate. Only people who toe the party line are allowed here! |
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AverageConsumer
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:35 AM
The RIAA needs to be allowed to sue everyone they can get their hands on. With each new case, especially against 12 yr olds, and 71 yr old grandparents, more publicity ensues. Now the mainstream media is commenting on it, and not all of it is favorable.
That 12 yr old had no choice but to settle. She got caught. I won't argue legalities here, it's been done to death. This will become all about image and PR. The more 'clueless' people they go after, the better it is for our cause.
The message is: don't buy it and don't download it. Christmas is coming, and RIAA music is NOT on the gift list.
Continue the boycott!
Leave the lawsuits alone, the RIAA will hang itself eventually. It's gonna take some patience to let this play out. 2k from people in the projects for downloading music is hardly what I'd call a big victory. |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:36 AM
fmlbullridr: You sound like a righteous upstanding dude. Pretty soon you will be able to download that one song for 99 cents or less. I hope you will do that instead of stealing the song. I would hate to see you get sued. The RIAA doesn't fight drugs and guns because that is not their job, they work for the record companies. |
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:38 AM
"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently and die gallantly. Specialization is for the insects."--Robert A. Heinlein.
If there's only one way you can make money, you're a sorry human being. Look at all the loggers who are out of work now. They adapted and moved on. Life is about change and adaptation. This does not exclude musicians. I'm not trying to be rude, just factual. The RIAA should've seen this coming with Napster. They missed the boat. |
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:42 AM
By the way, mroop, "fml" means female. So I'm not a dude, and no, I won't get sued, because I am educated and I know the law. Do you? And I know it's not their job, the point I am making is that our focus in this country is extremely skewed. |
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grumpygeezer
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:43 AM
"Yeah, God forbid you permit freedom of speech and open debate. Only people who toe the party line are allowed here!"
Try being a Republican wanting to sit in on a Democratic caucus sometime.
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grumpygeezer
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:46 AM
P.S. Hey, enemy, look at he disclaimer at the bottom of the webpage; it says, "This site is a criticism of the RIAA", and you know that before you registered; where does it say that this website is open to anyone no matter who they are? |
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:47 AM
Gee, it sounds like mroop has some mis placed agressiom!!! |
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azburner
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:47 AM
Hey Lars Ulrich: Whats up man? |
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svengali
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:51 AM
ahhh, trolls in our midst....Then you'll have to get a job in telemarketing calling people all day trying to sell them stuff while they hang up on you. Good luck, Mr. "Real Musician". Sounds like some inner turmoil with your telemarketing job....or are you an out of work musician?
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:51 AM
Female bull rider? You must be one tough chick - and I mean that as a compliment. :) I do know the law because I am a lawyer. The RIAA's job is to represent their clients - the record companies. The government's job is to combat drugs, gangs and hunger. So your beef is with ineffectual government and I agree with you. But that has nothing to do with the RIAA.
To grumpygeezer: I didn't see anything when I signed up that said I can only post if I have a certain point of view. So I will continue to bring a much needed dose of reality to this board. I think the readers here would benefit by seeing both sides of the picture. |
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:54 AM
"IF YOU WANT TO AVOID BEING SUE. BUY OUR MUSIC AND STOP STEALING THEM."
You should really take some time out from shaking down 12-yr-olds and retake some English and/or typing classes. Just a thought. (You guys wonder why we don't take you seriously, read the above quote out loud to yourself.) |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 11:55 AM
"The RIAA should've seen this coming with Napster. They missed the boat."
Yes they did. Does that justify theft of intellectual property? I don't think so. When the pay services come online I expect that you will denounce illegal file sharing and come over to the RIAA position. Am I correct? |
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:00 PM
Like I said before, I understand that it's the government's job to combat those things. My point is our focus as a society is so twisted. And you do have the right to free speech here, but I don't think that it will be greeted with open arms, because like grumpygeezer said, this site is for criticizing the RIAA.
And thanks for the compliment, I am a pretty tough chick. :) |
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Ripandburn
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:03 PM
Mroop, You probably should have asked yourself this before posting to this site " Does anyone actually give a crap what I have to say?" Go piss up a tree dick weed... |
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grumpygeezer
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:04 PM
"When the pay services come online I expect that you will denounce illegal file sharing and come over to the RIAA position. Am I correct?"
No, you are not correct.
Number one, file sharing per se is not illegal.
Number two, we will not be buying any non-used RIAA CD's.
We will be loyal to the namesake of the website: www.ROYCOTT-riaa! (And we have solid reasons.)
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:05 PM
Just a quick question, if you are who you claim, why did it take your industry thirty years to decide you wanted to persecute people for copying music. You were well aware of it, and your silence spoke quite loudly. |
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grumpygeezer
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:07 PM
Well, I admit my FINGERS are sometimes not correct.
I meant BOYCOTT-riaa, of course.
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TheTap
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:08 PM
""RIAA 1 Boycottcrybabies 0"
Lets not lose site of where this really stands.
Actually it's more like:
RIAA - 4
Boycott-RIAA - 60,000,000
I have 10s of thousands of mp3's. So do many others here. We already won. Are they gonna go house to house and collect computers? If not, the game was over a long time ago and they lost.
What's happening now is just prolonged nusance. |
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UmakeBabyJes...
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:10 PM
mroop...you make me laugh. You "guess" that because I am a "real musician", "my mommy pays my rent." You guessed wrong, dumb ass. And you used that "mommy pays your rent" line before, you are bright. Like a shimmering, wet turd in the moonlight. Anyway, you can download any of my music for free at http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/226/within.html and http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/223/endless_sorrow.html, and if you want all my songs, I can send em to you free. Why free? Because, I make money in other ways. Usally pimping your mom off, but that's a whole other story. I know it's hard for you to understand, cause your slow, but most people can do more than one thing. Sorry you got shorted on that. I would blame god if I was you. Mabey he's forgotten you. |
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Ripandburn
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:11 PM
TAP.......Nice.......thanks for reminding me just how much free music we actually have. 60 MILLION PEOPLE (WITH AN AVERAGE OF 100 SONGS EACH) hmmmm,,,, |
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svengali
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:12 PM
use the $2000 to buy mroop some typing and spelling lessons RIAA....or buy yourself a brain |
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AntiRepublican
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:13 PM
mroop...you state that file sharig is theft. Theft is a crime. Why is no one being prosecuted for crimes of theft then??
Or is this not your area of expertise?? |
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:13 PM
-RIAA-
How about a hell no? (You're just not smart enough for me.) |
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AntiRepublican
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:13 PM
mroop...you state that file sharing is theft. Theft is a crime. Why is no one being prosecuted for crimes of theft then??
Or is this not your area of expertise?? |
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jays
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:13 PM
fuck the RIAA. I dont see the harm in people downloading music for their own personal enjoyment. Now if those people are downloading songs, burning CD's and selling them for profit, that is wrong and they should be sued. But for the majority of us that just download music to listen to at home, work, etc...Whats the big deal?? The record companies and Artists have money coming out of their asses. Who the fuck needs 4 Escalades, 2 houses, a penthouse, etc?? The people downloading are just your average hard working americans that dont want to buy a CD full of crappy songs just to get the one song they like. Furthermore, I believe that music downloading off the internet gives some people a taste of what artist they like, and maybe then they will support that artist more, going to their concerts, buying their music, etc. And it especially pisses me off when these corporate bastards are going after kids!!! How sick is that. I wonder if they can sleep at night knowing what they are doing. Pretty soon this country will be communist. |
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grumpygeezer
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:13 PM
Troops, we can decide to ignore the trolls; responding to them probably dilutes our focus and distracts those who peruse this website hoping for good information and valid arguments, not verbal battles.
So, I for one, am going to re-focus.
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jays
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:13 PM
fuck the RIAA. I dont see the harm in people downloading music for their own personal enjoyment. Now if those people are downloading songs, burning CD's and selling them for profit, that is wrong and they should be sued. But for the majority of us that just download music to listen to at home, work, etc...Whats the big deal?? The record companies and Artists have money coming out of their asses. Who the fuck needs 4 Escalades, 2 houses, a penthouse, etc?? The people downloading are just your average hard working americans that dont want to buy a CD full of crappy songs just to get the one song they like. Furthermore, I believe that music downloading off the internet gives some people a taste of what artist they like, and maybe then they will support that artist more, going to their concerts, buying their music, etc. And it especially pisses me off when these corporate bastards are going after kids!!! How sick is that. I wonder if they can sleep at night knowing what they are doing. Pretty soon this country will be communist. |
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Ripandburn
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:17 PM
RIAA-------I haven't paid for a song in over 5 years....In fact I have given away prolly close to 1000 songs, however I have never given away an entire work (Album)I have sampled and made avail to the public partial pieces(individual tracks) for the purpose of education to the masses.... |
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Ripandburn
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:18 PM
Also ........wrong post before...
RIAA-----You probably should have asked yourself this before posting to this site " Does anyone actually give a crap what I have to say?" Go piss up a tree dick weed... |
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larshater
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:18 PM
This a sad commentry on how corporate America just doesn't give a shit As long as they are making money who cares? Mr Sherman et al should be real proud of themselves going after a 12 year old what's next going after kindergarteners |
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jays
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:18 PM
RIAA....you need a life thinking you are fooling anyone that your from the RIAA. If you are your lucky this is over the internet cause you would be lynched |
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jays
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:19 PM
RIAA....you need a life thinking you are fooling anyone that your from the RIAA. If you are your lucky this is over the internet cause you would be lynched |
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:19 PM
Amen, Jays. |
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Ripandburn
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:25 PM
Hey RIAA i jut downloaded two songs in the tme it took you to type that crappy comeback.. :) |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:25 PM
AntiRepublican said: "mroop...you state that file sharing is theft. Theft is a crime. Why is no one being prosecuted for crimes of theft then??"
Theft, violation of copyright law, whatever. The point is: IT IS ILLEGAL.
UmakeBabyJes said: if you want all my songs, I can send em to you free. Why free? Because, I make money in other ways."
So you have day job. Good for you! You choose to give away your music. THAT IS YOUR CHOICE. Some people want to make a living solely at music. They might choose not to give away their music. THAT IS THEIR CHOICE. Who are you to take something that doesn't belong to you? Are you God or a just a common criminal? I say the latter.
Jays said: "The record companies and Artists have money coming out of their asses."
Do you really believe that? I think you've been watching too much MTV. 99% of artists are broke, you dummy. |
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:27 PM
You might want to go to your law library and look up "implied consent".
And there is no need to shout, i'm standing right next to you. |
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Ripandburn
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:27 PM
Score....
Me 1275 Songs and counting
riaa $0 |
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tds67
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:27 PM
I think we should not only start a fund for the 12 year old girl to reimburse the $2,000, but we should donate an additional $1,000 on top of it and make it profitable for her (or, to look at it another way, pay her for pain and suffering). |
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AntiRepublican
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:29 PM
$2000 in your pocket, because you molested a 12 year-old. WOW, you should be real proud of that.
I'll be back later, I am downloading 200 more mp3's today. |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:29 PM
Grumpygeezer said: "Number one, file sharing per se is not illegal."
I never said it was, I specifically said "illegal file sharing". Thank you.
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UmakeBabyJes...
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:31 PM
"WE IGNORE THE THEFT OF OUR PRODUCTS IN THE PAST BECAUSE THERE WERE NO STEADY DECLINE IN OUR REVENUE UNTIL THE EVOLUTION OF FILE SHARING ON THE INTERNET. WE TOOK ACTION AND WON. CRIMINAL ACTIVITIES WILL NO LONGER BE TOLERATED. YOU MUST PAY!"
- Yes, we MUST pay. For blank CD's. And what did you win? I have over 10,000 songs. Seems like I won and EVERYONE I know won. But that's just me. Yay for me. Smooth move, wet shits. |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:33 PM
Wiley69 said: "You might want to go to your law library and look up "implied consent"."
I know what implied consent means. Obviously you are not a lawyer like me because if you think implied consent comes into play you don't know what the hell you are talking about, with all due respect. |
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Ripandburn
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:35 PM
Me 1278 Songs and counting
riaa $0 |
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AntiRepublican
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:36 PM
mroop....with all due respect, I don't think you are a lawyer. |
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:36 PM
Please explain the concept to us, with all due respect. |
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:43 PM
I like -RIAA-, he's funny! |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:44 PM
Yes I am a lawyer. Implied consent is very simple - it means that that one party has impliedly consented as opposed to explicitly consenting or not consenting at all. I have never even heard the argument that the record companies have somehow impliedly consented to having their intellectual property given away by third parties. That is ridiculous.
Please flesh out your theory - how does implied consent come into play? I gotta hear this one. :) |
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:46 PM
Just because you make a choice doesn't mean it's going to work out for you. If it did, I would choose to be rich, beautiful, perfect, and not have to do anything. Life's not fair. |
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jays
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:47 PM
Oh the artists and record companies are broke....whaaaahh Lets all set up a donation for them, i sooo feel sorry for them. You know what, I dont buy that bullshit for one second. And no i dont watch too much MTV, I get my information from news sources, not entertainment or reality TV you assfuck. Like i stated before, just having music on your computer for your own use, theres not anything wrong with that. If you are burning CD's and selling them to people, then that may be a problem. Music downloading will not go away. There will always be people who will download mp3's no matter what the RIAA does about it. They can not sue every person. And if they think that CD sales are down now, wait it will go down more now that they are suing people for downloading. I for one will never buy a CD, not because i am against supporting my favorite artists, but so that the RIAA will not get any of my money. The internet has let us be able to enjoy our favorite songs without being ripped off for the 15-20 dollar price for one CD, to get the one or two songs that we like. If the prices were resonable for CD's then maybe things would be different. Oh sorry for the multiple posts, im having server problems. Ohhh nooo maybe the RIAA is breaking into my computer...IM soooo scared!!!! I better go and delete all my music.. HAHAHA yeah right. by the way i work for an ISP and i will be damned if i help anyone supena documents! |
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slackdaddybj
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:48 PM
I am a "real musician" and I am poor. I also realize that all this talk of taking money from the artists is largely a smokescreen to detract from the real fact that the RIAA is upset that their profiteering and shortsightedness is costing them (the RIAA) profit. Why do they not go after Columbia House or BMG or the other CD clubs THAT DON"T PAY ROYALTIES TO THE ARTISTS! At least be honest and not try to twist the truth behind all this legal action. |
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Ripandburn
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:49 PM
Me 1282 Songs and counting
riaa $0 |
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:52 PM
For thirty years the average citizen has had the ability, and has been copying music. The recording industry took no action to prevent this, even though they were well aware of the practice.
No, I am not a lawyer, just a consumer who has supported an ungreatful, greedy industry for 35 years. |
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jays
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:53 PM
I agree with slackdaddybj, What about BMG or Columbia house?? Why not go after everyone that subscribes to them? It is the same damn thing as going after people that use kaaza. My point to the rich artist, like Justin Timberlake, Christina Aguleria, Britney Spears, Metallica, etc. These people are not poor. The RIAA im sure is not "broke" Im all for supporting the artists that you listen to, especially the talented ones that are starting out or that are not as widely known yet. |
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tds67
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:54 PM
Enough with the flamers already. They are here for a single purpose: to distract and dissipate our energy and anger. Ignore them.
Now for something that WILL make a difference: Let's start a fund for the 12 year old girl. I can't think of a better way to make a statement and generate the right kind of publicity.
The goal will be $2,000 plus an additional amount, say $1,000 or more. I myself will donate $100. We need someone that we can trust to coordinate and collect the funds. I vote for CodeWarrior.
LET'S DO THIS NOW!!! |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:55 PM
"by the way i work for an ISP and i will be damned if i help anyone supena documents!"
You will meekly do whatever they tell you to do. You have a big mouth on the internet but at your job you do what you are told like a good boy.
"Why do they not go after Columbia House or BMG or the other CD clubs THAT DON"T PAY ROYALTIES TO THE ARTISTS! "
For a real musician you are pretty damn ignorant. The RIAA represents Columbia House and BMG and a bunch of other record companies. That would be like me suing me. Lol. Next, record clubs do pay royalties at a reduced rate per the contract.
Now I am starting to understand you people a little bit. You are so filled with misinformation and ignorance that is is amazing! |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:57 PM
Wiley69 - thanks for the response. I would say that "waiver" would be a more appropriate theory than "implied consent" under the facts as you state them. But neither of these theories will hold any water in a court of law. That is just a fact. |
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IFeelFree
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:58 PM
RIAA future hit list:
1) Kindly old grandmother.
2) Child in wheelchair.
3) Decorated war veteran.
4) AIDS victim.
5) NYC Twin Towers firefighter.
6) Sports star/Olympic medal winner.
8) Terminally ill mother of young children.
7) Sons/daughters of judges, D.A.s, congressmen, etc.
8) Wealthy Republicans.
9) RIAA member.
With thousands of people about to be sued, sooner or later, some of these are bound to happen. What public relations disaster. |
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:59 PM
I guess it's a good thing we have jury trials................ |
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TheTap
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:04 PM
UmakeBabyJes - You're right. Everyone I know has HD's full of mp3's. Music sharing could stop today and I'd have a great collection to listen to. Beside that, 99% of what is being put out today is of no interest to me. Yea, I might want more urban hip-hop crap to add to my collection.
... and who said my mp3's are illegal??
... hopefully your tracers can detect private connections, like FTP, IRC and IM cause that's the only way you'll know.
Yawn
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jays
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:05 PM
mroop
Date: September 10, 2003 @ 12:55 PM
"by the way i work for an ISP and i will be damned if i help anyone supena documents!"
You will meekly do whatever they tell you to do. You have a big mouth on the internet but at your job you do what you are told like a good boy.
Ya dont know me at all and have no idea, I could only wish we were discussing this in person, then you would find out. We are all intitled to our opinions, but it takes a pretty slimy sob to belittle people on the internet. I started this post putting my own opionions about to RIAA, not bashing anyone personally, but then you people reply with personal attacks as your comment to my post "Do you really believe that? I think you've been watching too much MTV. 99% of artists are broke, you dummy" bravo, you have quite the big mouth also
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:06 PM
Yes it is a good thing we have jury trials. If you think a jury of ordinary citizens is going to feel sorry for a defendant who is offering up someone else's property for free then you are dreaming.
"Ladies and gentleman of the jury. How would you feel if you spent money to put together a recording studio, took months to record your own music, spent your own money to press up cd's, built your own web site to sell those cd's, and then Johnny took your music and offered it for free to millions of people?" |
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cosjon04
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:07 PM
-RIAA- Can you even use proper english? You sure forget a lot of S's where words should be plural. We obviously see here the retardation of your side of the argument and the people behind it. |
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cosjon04
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:10 PM
Oh in addition, I have a 4 year old cousin who uses Kazaa on a daily basis. Why not sue the fuck out of her. I'm sure she deserves it. |
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:11 PM
mroop- like I said, life's not always fair! |
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UmakeBabyJes...
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:13 PM
mroop says: "Some people want to make a living solely at music."
- Yes, they are lazy. I know. You don't have to tell me. They just don't want to grow up. I bust my ass 16 hours a day, and STILL have time to play my music AND pay my bills. But some people want to make a living solely at music, you say. I say, Life's a bitch, ask Brianna Lahara. Get a job. And just to remind you, it's the RIAA that is going after people, not the artists. So who is the crybaby now? Artists make the most off of live shows and merchandise.
Quote if the day:
"Waaah Wahhhh" - RIAA
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tds67
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:14 PM
I want the 12 year old girl being sued by the RIAA to profit and be rewarded for what she has done. I want her to feel good about herself again.
Donating $$$ to a fund for her is a great way to fight back against the RIAA. It would be great if she could make $1,000 or $2,000 over and above the settlement money she is required to pay. Imagine the positive press this would get and how it would counter the RIAA's message that this little girl is a criminal. |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:15 PM
Agreed - life is rarely fair!
To jays: How do you know that I don't work for the RIAA. Maybe when you spew your blatant falsehoods you are insulting me. Have you heard the saying: Know your enemy? You know nothing about the subject at hand, you are ignorant. Not an insult, just a fact. :) |
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:19 PM
I still stand by my earlier statement, "Well, we knew people were doing this for 35 years, and did nothing to stop it, but now we changed our minds, I can't afford the new house this year."
Don't mis understand me, I am not condoning the theift of any artist's work; my issues are with the highly imballanced compensation, and the heavy handed tatics of the industry. |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:19 PM
UmakeBabyJes said: "Yes, they are lazy. ... Artists make the most off of live shows and merchandise."
Lazy because they want to make a living solely off music? That makes no sense. As far as artists making money off live shows and merchandise - what about the songwriter? What about the producer? These people don't make any money from live shows and merchandise. A songwriter writing a beautiful song doesn't deserve to get paid? Second, the artist making money from live shows and merchandise was promoted by the record company or no one would be at the show buying a ticket and a t-shirt.
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:20 PM
I agree with wiley69. |
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f-the-riaa
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:20 PM
Time to counter sue the RIAA in far away remote locations. Sue them in small claims for $500 or so, for a real oddball reason. They will have to fly their lawyers to the remotes locales, pay for hotels, etc. Hassle the piss out of them, make them feel like that 12 year old honor student. They also have a "800" number, tell them your opinion ( dime's on them).
MAKE THEM PAY!!! |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:22 PM
Wiley69 said: "I still stand by my earlier statement, "Well, we knew people were doing this for 35 years, and did nothing to stop it, but now we changed our minds, I can't afford the new house this year.""
You can stand by your statement. I'm just saying in a court of law the theory of implied consent would not fly as a defense to copyright infringement. |
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:23 PM
I don't think they are necessarily lazy for wanting to make a living off of music. But there are many things that I can't make a living off of these days, that I could've before technology. So find something else.
Cowboys never sued the railroad for taking away the way they made their living. (i.e. herding cattle, which is all but extinct now because of fences, trucks, railroads, etc.) |
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mrbonzo
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:25 PM
MROOP, did you happen to make note of the address you typed into your little browser window before you arrived at this site? Of course, the majority of people here are going to be against the RIAA - that's the point. Do you frequent other discussion forums throwing around the claim that, 'only people who agree with the topic are allowed here'? What a completely invalid and ignorant claim.
All that aside, how many 'real musicians' really get paid, anyway?
Since you're a 'real lawyer' who obviously isn't supported by 'mommy', I'd be interested to know how with such childish basis for arguements you are able to afford access to the computer you type your incoherent BS on.
Go find your internet conflict elsewhere, this site is for those who are affected and concerned with this issue. Live out your ignorance induced fantasy of obtaining any sort of prestige in the law community on a forum that will allow you to do so. |
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jays
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:25 PM
i could care less if you work for the RIAA, i wasnt bashing an individual, just the corporation. If you do work for the RIAA then i hope you feel good about yourself making this world a "better place" and one more step toward commumism |
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tds67
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:25 PM
We need to do something useful, like create a fund for the 12 year old girl and gain public support.
The alternative is to continue to listen to the drivel of people like mrpoop. |
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:28 PM
This is an open forum, we all have a right to our respective opinions, whatever they may be. |
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jays
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:29 PM
i agree, there needs to be more DISCUSSION instead of juvenile name calling |
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jays
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:31 PM
Question for anyone that knows....If you use Kaaza, and put your kaaza to Not share, can they still find you? |
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:35 PM
I don't know for sure, I would think your IP addy would still be logged. |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:36 PM
"i could care less if you work for the RIAA, i wasnt bashing an individual, just the corporation."
Well then I apologize, I thought you were speaking to me as an individual when you called me an "assfuck". My mistake. :) |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:38 PM
"Question for anyone that knows....If you use Kaaza, and put your kaaza to Not share, can they still find you?"
If you don't share you won't be sued so DON'T SHARE. |
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justed
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:39 PM
“mroop” (Yes I am a lawyer.”), “-RIAA-” (: “I'M REALLY GONNA GETCHA.”): Good to see your presence.
“Now I am starting to understand you people a little bit. You are so filled with misinformation and ignorance that is is amazing!”
Question: Is this all about the cabal of the “music industry” not wanting the listening public to be able to hear music until after they’ve paid for it (via filesharing etc.)?
Question: Do you expect us to believe that ‘you’ represent the ‘artists’ when we think you represent the music industry cabal that acts through the RIAA?
Question: Do you personally believe that defense of (self-evidently) flawed copyright law is upholding your responsibilities as a lawyer?
Question: Are you personally unconcerned by the moral and ethical dilemma that supporting a cabal of so-called ‘music industry’ companies who have sponsored legislation solely to protect their own very narrow self-defined interests at the expense of all human freedom across broad areas of endeavor has created?
Question: Do you personally not see the far-reaching consequences of any ‘success’ your willingness to support the ‘music industries’ actions will have?
Thanking you in advance,
I am,
justed
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fmlbullridr
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:40 PM
If you're not sharing, then it's not illegal. Per se. It's the people who are making the files available that they are going after. And only if you have 1,000 songs or more available. Apparently they have placed the value of $1.00 per song. (which is still over priced, if you ask me)
http://www.usdoj.gov/criminal/cybercrime/17-18red.htm |
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mrbonzo
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:43 PM
Justed, all questions that a lawyer might be able to respond to. mroop, however, has a little research to do. Judging by the promptness of his posts, I'm sure he's got plenty of time on his hands.
Aw, the marvels of the internet. I think today I'll be.... |
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Spica
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:50 PM
So in the unlikely even of getting caught, they take all the money I have in the bank?
OK let's do some economic analysis:
Probability of getting caught:
P=2,000/60,000,000 = 0.003%
Average settlement:
A=$10,000.00
Expected net loss:
L = P*A = $0.33
COST OF ONE SINGLE CHEAPEST CD:
C=$12.00
C > L
Sorry RIAA.
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Spica
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:51 PM
*unlikely event |
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dodge1
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:52 PM
FYI
Grokster boss to pay 12 yr old girls fine. More info here:
http://www.vnunet.com/News/1143514
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justed
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:52 PM
mrbonzo (Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:43 PM):
I can wait (actually, I’ll check back) for an answer.
justed
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:53 PM
Question: Is this all about the cabal of the “music industry” not wanting the listening public to be able to hear music until after they’ve paid for it (via filesharing etc.)?
No, it's about copyright infringement. Wanna hear a sample? Go to amazon.com.
Question: Do you expect us to believe that ‘you’ represent the ‘artists’ when we think you represent the music industry cabal that acts through the RIAA?
Talk to some RIAA artists in private and see what they think of you. Hint - they don't like you stealing their music.
Question: Do you personally believe that defense of (self-evidently) flawed copyright law is upholding your responsibilities as a lawyer?
The law is the law. You don't like it? Lobby Congress. You don't have the right to break the law just because you don't like it. That's called anarchy.
Question: Are you personally unconcerned by the moral and ethical dilemma that supporting a cabal of so-called ‘music industry’ companies who have sponsored legislation solely to protect their own very narrow self-defined interests at the expense of all human freedom across broad areas of endeavor has created?
A loaded question. Of course the music industry supports legislation that is in it's interest. You don't like capitalism? Then move to Cuba. Lobby Congress. But you won't do that. You will just steal music and justify if it any way you can.
Question: Do you personally not see the far-reaching consequences of any ‘success’ your willingness to support the ‘music industries’ actions will have?
Yes I do. Drive file sharing underground. Offer music for download at a far price. Simple as that.
"Judging by the promptness of his posts, I'm sure he's got plenty of time on his hands."
MrBozo - You still don't believe I'm a lawyer? Think what you want, it doesn't bother me none. :)
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brianmcneil
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:53 PM
How much does it cost to put a trial into court. How much do the RIAA lawyers get paid? Maybe, just maybe this is the reason that artists and record companies are losing money through supporting the RIAA |
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wiley69
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:55 PM
Hey all,
Thanks for a stimulating discussion, but I've been up all nite, and it's time to go to bed.
Thanks! |
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Ripshaw
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:55 PM
I sure wish we could boycott lawyers but they would just sue us for discriminating against the mentally handicap. A world without the record industry would be like a picnic without fire ants and anthrax. |
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hate-kill-de...
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:56 PM
first of all, i think that -RIAA- is just some lame ass kid with too much time on his hands trying to piss off people who are working for a cause.
mroop-"Well then I apologize, I thought you were speaking to me as an individual when you called me an "assfuck". My mistake. :)"
well yeah im sure he was because you do seem to be an assfuck, but more in detail id say that you are also a felch monger, because after you have an assfuck, you like to suck out your giz with a straw. - RIAA are nazis
somewhere up there, mroop said something like "if you put together mp3s, spent all your money preparing them and then johnny goes and gives them to millions of people for free how would you feel." well mroop its you who keeps saying that life is tough, and also why should people who download music be sued?? if anyone should be sued its the person to provided them means to download it.
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hate-kill-de...
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:57 PM
first of all, i think that -RIAA- is just some lame ass kid with too much time on his hands trying to piss off people who are working for a cause.
mroop-"Well then I apologize, I thought you were speaking to me as an individual when you called me an "assfuck". My mistake. :)"
well yeah im sure he was because you do seem to be an assfuck, but more in detail id say that you are also a felch monger, because after you have an assfuck, you like to suck out your giz with a straw. - RIAA are nazis
somewhere up there, mroop said something like "if you put together mp3s, spent all your money preparing them and then johnny goes and gives them to millions of people for free how would you feel." well mroop its you who keeps saying that life is tough, and also why should people who download music be sued?? if anyone should be sued its the person(s) to provided them means to download it.
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hate-kill-de...
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:57 PM
first of all, i think that -RIAA- is just some lame ass kid with too much time on his hands trying to piss off people who are working for a cause.
mroop-"Well then I apologize, I thought you were speaking to me as an individual when you called me an "assfuck". My mistake. :)"
well yeah im sure he was because you do seem to be an assfuck, but more in detail id say that you are also a felch monger, because after you have an assfuck, you like to suck out your giz with a straw. - RIAA are nazis
somewhere up there, mroop said something like "if you put together mp3s, spent all your money preparing them and then johnny goes and gives them to millions of people for free how would you feel." well mroop its you who keeps saying that life is tough, and also why should people who download music be sued?? if anyone should be sued its the person(s) to provided them means to download it.
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thestrokes
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 1:59 PM
yah, one time this fed busted up into my house, like all up in my business, and popped a few into my shin... like how the hell do you know im downloading fuckin music from the internet? hes all like, Your isp ratted you out, then im all like - eat shit beeyatch! |
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thestrokes
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:01 PM
yeah, RIAA are a bunch of nazi's, stealing money for stuff we can get for free =P |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:01 PM
"if anyone should be sued its the person to provided them means to download it."
First of all the file sharing services are being sued. Second, when someone uses a gun to murder, is it the fault of the murderer of the gun manufacturer? If you break the law you are responsible, don't blame the tool. That is an abdication of your personal responsibility. It is weak minded.
"RIAA are nazis"
Nazis sent people into gas chambers and murdered them. Your analogy is inappropriate and offensive. You have no respect for the millions of innocent people who died at the hands of the Nazis. Disgusting.
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thestrokes
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:02 PM
well aparently you are a nazi... idiot |
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thestrokes
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:04 PM
anyway ,mroop, yeah, i know all about Nazis, and yeah, how the swastika was a sybol of good luck.. did you know that? |
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hate-kill-de...
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:04 PM
hey -RIAA- ill downloading music all i fuckin want, ive done nothing wrong, i download music and buy cds, but why buy a cd to support an artist that only has one song you like?? its stupid, and you obviously arent part of RIAA because they wont waste their time on this site and im sure that they can use proper grammar. RIAA are greedy bastards who are leeching money off of innocent people for profit.
hey mroop, nazis DID send people into gas chambers, and guess what, RIAA are taking away peoples money and their freedom to listen to music, we are even i dont care if you are insulted, infact im glad if you are insulted because that means ive accomplished what i meant to. |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:04 PM
"well aparently you are a nazi... idiot"
What are you 12 years old? Don't you have someone to beat up on the playground?
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hate-kill-de...
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:05 PM
mroop, shooting someone with a gun is quite a bit different, if you are suing the programs leave the people alone. |
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mroop
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:07 PM
The people are using the progams. Don't want to get sued? Don't use the program. Accept responsibility for your actions. Rob a store, get caught, pay the price. |
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AverageConsumer
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:10 PM
Out of all this trolling and response, one thing comes to mind:
mroop has stated, "Talk to some RIAA artists in private and see what they think of you. Hint - they don't like you stealing their music."
OK, fair enough. I want to see loads and loads of public service announcements, by each and every artist, denouncing file sharing, and calling all those who download "despicable criminals".
I want them to come on national media, look straight into the camera and say, "We want you to stop stealing our music. We want you all to go to the store and pay whatever our organization wishes to charge for the *privilege* of listening to our product."
I want to hear it straight from them personally, on camera, to the nation and the world. I want to hear it every single day, from every single artist who feels that strongly about it. I want them to *personally* denounce the practice in public if they feel that strongly about it.
They should look the public in the eye and tell them to stop being lowlife freeloaders and to start acting like customers.
We can start with J-Low "from da block/hood/ghetto/wherever."
Sounds reasonable to me. They're used to being on stage and the center of attention, shouldn't be much of an effort, really. |
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azburner
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:18 PM
" BUNCH OF CRIMINALS STEALING FROM HARDWORKING INDIVIDUALS."
Now that is B.S. You are way off calling us criminals , a lot of us don't share files . But we are boycotting a TYRANT! |
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cholera
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:21 PM
This has quickly become ludicrous. It's apparent that "certain" individuals are misrepresenting their identities in a feeble attempt to disguise ineffectual opinions. Firstly, an organization deeming an act "theft", does not make it necessarily so, thus rendering the argument null. Secondly, the "artists" in reference, are not being stolen from/sampled/borrowed because the material is owned by the label in most cases, NOT the artist. Finally, what is to become of the taxes paid for recordable media over the last ten years, if file-sharing ever IS deemed illegal by the law? I'm certain that many of us would benefit from the returns, assuming that the RIAA is honorable enough to refund monies spent on non-existent services. Wouldn't they? |
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Sonic1992
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Date: September 10, 2003 @ 2:22 PM
Lots of Americans right now are dying far away in the middle east, and the RIAA is wasting Government money suing people for damn music!! RIAA, You make me SICK. You're SCUM *I* Download! AND *I* BUY CD's TOO! BUT I WILL NOT PAY YOU SCUMBAGS 18.00 FO | |
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