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progrocktv	Subject: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Apple Computer has determined that customers void their warranty if they attempt to use its products to play copy-protected CDs. It lists Shakira's "Laundry Service," Jennifer Lopez's "J to Tha L-O!" and Celine Dion's "A New Day Has Come," all of which are on the Sony Music label Epic Records, as releases known to be protected. The topic is addressed in an online help document that is part of the AppleCare Knowledge Base section of Apple's official Web site. Consumers are directed to the document, article ID No. 106882, if they ask for help because their computer starts up to a gray screen or becomes unresponsive or they cannot eject what Apple describes as "copy-protected audio discs, which resemble compact discs but technically are not." Consumers are warned that the three listed titles are probably not the only ones that may cause these problems.
rv36116	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Shooting themselves in the foot eh? Dumb move on apple's part, they've probably received a hefty payoff from sony and other labels who's cd's have created these problems... don't these idiots see that this will get them nothing but enemies. Damn fat cats in highrises and just have no idea. - retards.
muralp	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Insane...ruin your computer and that will protect the industry fat cats? Pathetic...don't give 'em a dime!
IndyCharmer	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM I know that Apple will never be a part of my computer future....
Remye	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM I don't think apple did it on purpose.. they are just covering their collective asses.. and wallets..it almost looks like they are trying to get Sony to quit phucking around..cuz now the person who uses a copy protected (read corrupted) cd can and probably WILL go after Sony for the time/money/effort to fix the mess
Mister-Smith	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Who cares about copyrighted CD's if they wont let us buy our music i guess we will have to download it ?
furrball316	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Maybe when Sony has to pay to fix a few computers because of the anti-copy scam they're trying to pull on us they'll reconsider. I don't know how many people are going to want to keep a disc they can't play on ANY player and certainly not one that cost more in damage than the (overinflated) price of the disc. And I'm sure Sony won't be happy about paying out more in repair costs than they made from the disc that damaged the computer. BTW, I didn't know the Jennifer Lopez & Shakira discs were copy protected, then again, I don't look for their discs anyway. Has Sony been putting labels on the discs to identify them as copy protected or are they just springing them on unsuspecting customers?
Mister-Smith	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Surely all that needs doing is people to hack BIG BUISNESS computers such as systems at Microsoft or Sony even and put Illegal MP3s on them and rename files to names of illegal mp3. ?
goldenpi	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Already done. p2p at work is popular enough. The office T1 or T3 line is a tempting p2p system. Sooner or later whoever the RIAA hires will disrupt a company network running p2p software. The employie using the software will be fired of course, but the important thing is the large lawsuit
goldenpi	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Already done. p2p at work is popular enough. The office T1 or T3 line is a tempting p2p system. Sooner or later whoever the RIAA hires will disrupt a company network running p2p software. The employie using the software will be fired of course, but the important thing is the large lawsuit
StephenHinkle	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM If you get one of these in your drive, REPORT IT IN THE CLASS ACTION: http://www.milberg.com/mil-cgi-bin/mil?templ=featured/audiocds.html
Critto	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM rv36116, it's a real stupidity of Apple. It's dumbness as I think. However, it's also a DUMBNESS of those recording companies, who apply such 'protection' techniques as mentioned; such a move simply decreases the sale of their CDs (who wants to buy a CD if it is non-usable? and, doesn't it qualify buyer to claim his/her warranty rights by demanding return of the money (spent on the CD), if this CD doesn't work in a computer player? In Poland, it rather would ... And in most of European countries too, I think; I don't know how about USA ... Anyway, Apple is just another company to ... hmm.. boycott?? they are wise anyway; wiser than RIAA and MPAA companies; they support Linux, and that's a great deal of good deed. well, maybe we should e-mail them (I want to see massive e-mails, but one per person, coming to their e-mailbox), DEMANDING to change this warranty policy ?? What do you think?? Yours, Critto, http://www.libertaryzm.prv.pl
Critto	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM class action ?? I think StephenHinkle is right, and I want to thank him for such a great idea ... "Unfortunately" I haven't bought any of those CDs (not listening to this kind of music, sorry), so I don't qualify ... But to all, who sued, or are going to sue this awful company (UMG) for their awful policy ("protecting" the CDs and thus making them unusable), I wish YOU WIN, and I cross my fingers for you ... Yours, Critto, http://www.libertaryzm.prv.pl
Critto	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM class action ?? I think StephenHinkle is right, and I want to thank him for such a great idea ... "Unfortunately" I haven't bought any of those CDs (not listening to this kind of music, sorry), so I don't qualify ... But to all, who sued, or are going to sue this awful company (UMG) for their awful policy ("protecting" the CDs and thus making them unusable), I wish YOU WIN, and I cross my fingers for you ... LAWLESNESS must be stopped !! Heh, anyway -- don't y'all see the perversion?? The companies demand we obeyed their (er, the state's tyrannical 'laws' which exists because of their lobbing ... And in while, they don't want to obey other rules (including laws, too), like consumer protection regulations, fair trade practices ... And THEY demand us to listen to them ?? Yours, Critto, http://www.libertaryzm.prv.pl
Critto	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM oops, excuse me for doubling the message ... I've accidentally clicked on the 'Post' button before I've added the last sentence ... Anyway, there's one more interesting point: ++ Consumers are directed to the document, article ID No. 106882, if they ask for help because their computer starts up to a gray screen or becomes unresponsive or they cannot eject what Apple describes as "copy-protected audio discs, which resemble compact discs but technically are not."++ yes -- technically, they [copy-protected 'CDs'] are NOT CDs!! At least Philips, the creator of CD standard, claims so and demands that all obeyed the standard or stopped to use the name 'CD'. So, from this point of view, Apple may be right ... They only defend their legal rights against unsubstantiated claims ... Anyway, CD-ROM drives are for CDs, and not -- for example -- for plastic fast-food plates ) or pseudo "CDs" made from paper or protected ... Anyway, it's obvious to me, that those who bought this sh*t should sue the recorders ... Yours, Critto, http://www.libertaryzm.prv.pl
thumbtack	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM One issue that noone is getting about corrupted Cds is that the copyprotection doesn't expire ever. Copyright is a limited term, not eternal. When the copyright expires, the work is still protected having the result of extending copyright until infinity. This is a problem. The other thing that is mentioned from time to time is that the actual "fair uses" become unavailable. Forget about the copying etc. those two points are where the battle will be won.
W-B	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM In layman's terms, this whole business which 'thumbtack' elaborated on in the post directly above would be called "adding insult to injury." Moreover, as to this "fair use" business: Laws are only as good as the people who enforce them. In the old Soviet Union, for example, they had a constitution which supposedly guaranteed the right to free speech, free assembly, labor unions etc. -- but in fact, as we saw there, especially under Stalin, such rights did not exist whatsoever. To the RIAA and the multinational 'entertainment-industrial complex,' "fair use" means absolutely, positively nothing - nothing at all. To them, it's merely a privilege, not a right; and this kind of attitude (plus their overall distrust of the consumer) enables them to carry out such blatantly discriminatory, exclusionary / exclusivist, crypto-racist "copy-protectionist" measures such as this, the clear aim of which is to completely and totally disenfranchise and disempower their potential customers.
goldenpi	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM By the time those copyrights expire the CDs will be lost, broken, or even oxidised. The only sigficicence of the protection will be that even when the copyright expires distributeing the music will still be illegal .
dolph80	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM I agree with the views of this website. Damn the RIAA!! I have created an online petition at www.petitiononline.com to fight the RIAA and record companies. Show your support by visisting the link below and signing the petition. http://www.PetitionOnline.com/riaawar/petition.html
FadedInTheLight	Subject: Has any of this changed since its orignal post? Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM I know that one of Apple's slogans is now "Rip, Mix, Burn" so has Apple reversed its position here?
Daveyjones	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM just a reminder to everyone.... none of this would have ever happned if a few million bad apples didnt ruin it for all of us by sharing and riping copyrighted music .
goldenpi	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Apple had quite a fight with the music industry over that slogan. They were accused of encourageing piracy . Didn't stop them. Apple doesn't use DRM or copyright protection unless it has no other option. The DVD player has DRM, because thats required by the CSS license. Its iPod MP3 player has only two pieces of copyright protection: A notice in the manual that reminds users that downloading is illegal, and a restriction in the player that stops anyone getting music off it. Apple thought the player might be used as a music transporter, so people could exchange their 30-gig mp3 collections. That was broken quickly and easily through, and was probably included more as a gesture to the music industry than to stop infringement
JustASquirrel	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM It is also very interesting that Sony is caught on the other side of the fence as it were with their NetMD Mini-Disc players. Users are screaming for upload capabilities to match the download, but Sony is holding fast in an attempt to protect the content: http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/11.02/sony.html
Shinobi-iri	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Definitely a sticky issue. Granted, people wanting warranty coverage for what appears to be a CD would ask for it from the company they got their computer from, because there is no apparant reason not to. However, when Philips declares that these things simply are _not_ CDs at all and demands that they stop associating the name of UMG's "circular disks" with their own Compact Disc, it is simply not Apple's fault at all when looked at from this viewpoint. As Critto said, it's like sticking plastic fast food plates into your drive. You know nothing good will happen. Only, in this case, the plastic fast food plates have had a large hole punched through the center and have been designed to look like a real CD. When this happens to most people who have a) a Mac and b) a fooked up cd drive because of a copy-protected "CD", they should try and get Warranty replacement. Since we now know that will fail, they should sue the purveyor of the faulty disc for damages. This isn't Apple's fault, guys -- and I think, in some obscure way, they are trying to bring attention to that. They sure didn't anticipate these crappily produced facsimiles of Compact Discs being stuck in their Drives when they wrote up their warranty a while ago, I'm sure. When you buy some bulk popcorn, and only about 80% of the kernels Pop, you don't look at the machine or pot that you made it in and say "Damn you machine/pot!!!!! How dare you not Pop all of these kernels!" -- you look at the grade and quality of the popping corn that you have, and, if it sucks royally, then you buy better popcorn. Similarly, these copy-protected 'CD's likely came from a someone who would be considered a purveyor of high quality popcorn - or Compact Discs, for that matter. Don't sue the maker of the CD Drive, sue the group who put out the bad discs that wrecked the machine.
Shinobi-iri	Subject: oops Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Last paragraph, I could leave it to the Law of Fucking Up to screw up what I was writing, hehe. ...likely came from Someone who would NOT be considered a purveyor of high quality.. There. Now my overactive, perfectionist, "EVERY LETTER MUST BE ANGLED CORRECTLY WHEN WRITTEN" mind can rest. I sure hope DaveyJones won't throw me in his locker for this. =P
Seikatsu	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM As far as one getting stuck in the drive. There is a little hole on most CD drives that bending a small paperclip and pushing it into that hole (when it hits the button in that hole it causes a manual eject, this can actually be done with no power) I say why isn't there a Boycott-Sony.com being created for this?
firemaiden	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Quoting FadedInTheLight,"I know that one of Apple's slogans is now "Rip, Mix, Burn" so has Apple reversed its position here?" I mentioned that on another thread,it's funny how so many companies promote filesharing(and always super fast!)and then wan't to jump on the bandwagon to sue their customers....heh!
RIAAKiller	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Thats sad.. but not as sad as the RIAA is going to be. http://www.thebighack.org
purfus	Subject: Re: NEWS:Copy protected CD's VOID warranty!!!! Date: November 30, 2003 @ 9:12 PM Koodos to apple for not supporting the DRM crap.